Daniel Mackler and Barbara Rogers came up in a very interesting conversation

P: Hi Sylvie I don't know if you already know this, it's the translation of an interview that Martin Miller gave to the German magazine Der Spiegel

Sylvie: Yes I read it... the issues between him and his mother are understandable, because his mother had not made her discoveries until he was an adult, so he was affected by his own childhood like the rest of us, but that does not take away from the discoveries Alice made later on and the great books she left for us to help us resolve our own repression. If you have read all of her books, she shares her pain of not having been able to be there for her son when he was little and she apologizes to him, and hopefully one day he can resolve his own repression and be free, if he has not done already.

I think he did a good job on the preface to his mother’s French edition book “L’essentiel d’Alice Miller” but I still felt a little bit of residue left of unresolved feelings between him and his mother, but his unresolved feelings are between him and his mother and have nothing to do with us, but between them, our issues are with our own parents. 

Alice has never hurt us in any way, but DM and others like him are hurting the public by creating a smoke screen to hide the truth and facts from themselves and others, like Sigmund Freud and others did with their crazy theories to protect parents and hide behind so they did not have to face and feel their own painful truths. 

DM and others like him work very hard to suppress Alice Miller's books from reaching more people because they are afraid of being exposed by her books. 

It makes me sad to see people exploiting Alice and her son and doing personal attacks towards Alice making her their scapegoat for the wrongs done to them by their own parents. 

Our issues are with our parents not with Alice. Alice was a human being like the rest of us and made mistakes in her personal life like we all have, but she was an honest and a sincere woman that focused on facts. Have you read the Preface to the Revised Edition of 1997 of the Book “Breaking Down the Wall of Silence”

P: No, I hadn't read that. Thanks a lot for sharing it.

Sylvie: From this preface is where DM takes her words out of context and twists her words to attack Alice Miller in his critique of Alice Miller, he is a total psychopath. His limitations are so much bigger than Alice Miller’s, and I don’t think in his lifetime he will ever come close to the depths of Alice Miller. 

Alice Miller's behavior was not abusive at all to her daughter. But I think Daniel was being extremely abusive to Alice Miller with his character assassination of her. Her daughter was not just a gift to Alice Miller for being the trigger of her awakening, but a gift to all of us also, because without her daughter she probably would never have written her books the way she did and I would still be living in isolation or dead, I don’t think I could have lived with my feelings and perceptions all alone much longer without her books and for that I am very grateful her daughter was born. 

Alice Miller has been the most heroic pioneer person in our world, who stood for truth and facts, exposing the lies and hypocrisy of society; of course, she was human and made mistakes like the rest of us, but she was always honest, authentic, genuine and when she noticed a mistake of hers she was honest and sincere and she only deserves our compassion, understanding, gratitude and not our judgments, projections, and transferences; this guy is a perfectionist that lives in denial of his imperfections and limitations; projecting himself into Alice Miller and if someone is abusive is him. Enjoying a child’s affection and innocence is not abusive at all, unless we take advantage of those qualities for our own cruel and selfish reasons and Alice Miller was far from being cruel and selfish in any way.

P: I completely share your views on Alice, she was not perfect of course, like the rest of us, and never pretended to be, simply because she was human and that is what makes her so credible and authentic to me, unlike those critics who are looking for flaws to prove her wrong and attack her...above all of them DM with his stupid perfectionism ....luckily he himself has been faithful to his own theory and does not have any children...I would feel really sorry for them!!!! I just listen to the 2nd part of his video criticizing Alice ...easily to be summed up...BS...Alice always pointed out that she did not want to be considered as an idol or a guru.....if people do that it's their problem, not hers...

Sylvie: Exactly! I could not have said it better myself. For that Barbara Rogers if she is "lost in a fog of admiration" is not Alice's fault that she lost herself admiring Alice Miller, but the reality is, she did not lose herself, because she has never found herself, once we truly find ourselves we can never lose ourselves again, the little girl she once was still lost in the fog of admiration with her own mother now transferred into a substitute figure, Alice Miller. 

It’s her problem if she is still a lost little girl and loses herself in admiration over others, she is another malignant narcissist that has memorized good knowledge hijacked from Alice, but has not experienced it at a personal level and now is trying to cast herself in the role of parent figure over others and misuses this good knowledge to manipulate and use others to distract herself, so she does not have to face and feel the repressed excruciating emotions of the child she once was; reenacting her childhood drama all over again with the people she is trying to help, but now she playing the role of her mother and the people she is trying to help, playing the role of the child she and they once were and they all remain lost in a maze with no way out, staying prisoners of childhood for eternity.

Me too, I would feel sorry for DM’s children if he had any, but maybe if he had his own children to use as his scapegoat or poisonous container, he would not need to make Alice and others his scapegoat or poisonous container, like Hitler, if he had his own children to use as his scapegoat, maybe he would not have to take it out on the Jews and other minority groups making them his scapegoat for the wrongs done to him by his own father.

P: Yes...that's true.

Comments I made in the book discussion of Daniel Mackler

Sylvie Imelda Shene: Even dough I agree with everything said in this excerpt. I just started reading the book and find his choice of words to be highly confusing, even abusive, and I can’t recommend this book. Alice Miller is the only person I encounter on this planet,, with whom I agree 100%. The words below written by Alice Miller to me, when I asked her to comment on letters I received from one of her readers, came to mind: “AM: I have learned over the years of my work on the internet that there are readers who SEEM to understand SOME of what I have written, at least intellectually, but they are still so afraid of their very cruel parents and of their repressed FEELINGS of rage towards them that they are constantly looking for scapegoats. They thus live in continual confusion pretending that they are healed and even offering help and empathy to others. But eventually, they use unconsciously other people (even the ones who are quite friendly to them) as poisonous containers like their parents did to them, and if the offended people begin to defend themselves they can become very mean. I can only urge you to trust your feelings and to NOT offer your empathy and interest to everybody just because they say they read and understood everything I have written. In most cases, it is a lie. To understand my books means to overcome the fear of one`s parents, to honestly feel the justified rage TOWARD THEM, and to no longer use others to get free from the accumulated rage.” Alice Miller wrote this message Sylvie Imelda Shene: Alice Miller’s criticism is not the only thing I am concerned about, there is more, like for example his views on abortion and sex, his choice of words can be very confusing and guilt-inducing to his readers that still are emotionally blind and take his words for face value and not see he might be unconsciously telling his true story of what happened to him and how he was treated as a child by using harsh words. When it comes to abortion no one says it better than Alice Miller “Not everyone is capable of thinking in real, concrete terms. Many seek refuge in religious beliefs. In their weakness, they place their trust in “relics,” awaiting salvation at the hands of one stronger than themselves. Anyone who claims to be a strong and knowledgeable authority for such people, and to be acting on their behalf, has the duty to be conscious of the appropriate facts. If they aren’t, if they ignore or neglect that duty, claiming instead that their palpable lack of information and their abstract conceptions of “life” is sanctioned by God and practiced in the name of humanity, they are acting against life, by misusing the weakness and trust of the faithful and dangerously confusing them. The injunction against abortion goes even further: Consciously or unconsciously, it represents support for cruelty against children and active complicity in the creation of unwanted existences, existences that can easily become a liability for the community at large. … It is, in fact, not surprising to find that those who are both victims and apologists for the use of violence and severity against children are often those who most passionately proclaim their love of the unborn child, i.e., the kernel of life. Abortion can, indeed, be seen as the most powerful symbol of the psychic annihilation and mutilation practiced since time immemorial on children. But to combat this evil merely at the symbolic level deflects us from the reality we should not evade for a moment longer: the reality of the abused and humiliated child, which, as a result of its disavowed and unresolved injuries, will insidiously become, either openly or aided by hypocrisy, a danger to society.”

http://sylvieshene.blogspot.com/2011/01/protecting-life-after-birth.html#!/2011/01/protecting-life-after-birth.html

I don’t have time to write right now, but as soon I can I will go into more details.

Sylvie Imelda Shene: Sabina, I agree with most of what you are saying about sex and when a person becomes fully conscious, naturally becomes abstinent from sex, but not by choice, but because it’s near to impossible to find another conscious partner at the same level. Telling unconscious people not to have sex, is not realistic and does not work and the author of this book seems to have a problem even with masturbation! Why should not a person enjoy his/her body? Was he not allowed to enjoy his own body as a little boy? The purpose of life is to have fun in balance without hurting yourself or others, to be enjoyed, and shared and for us to become free to enjoy life in the present moment, we must face our history and feel our repressed feelings, at our own pace. We must face the pain in our lives. The only way out is through it. Nothing in the external world, no religion, no job, no geographical travel or move, no relationship, and not any amount of money can save us from the pain of our past. Until we walk through our pain, we will keep reenacting, repeating, and recreating our past in the present moment. Dr. Alice Miller in her book, The Truth Will Set You Free; Overcoming Emotional Blindness and Finding Your True Adult Self says: “The past always catches up with us, in our relationships with other people and especially with our children.” The only way to release the pain is to face it, articulate it, and feel it as it arises. If we can feel it we can heal it. I know sometimes the pain can be overwhelming, and we need to take a break from it by going to work, taking care of ourselves, and some distractions of safe fun, but we must take time to face, be, and articulate our pain and feel it as it arises until is gone. Because pretty much every person on the planet has been abused and traumatized to a degree by parental and societal ignorance, pain comes to everyone’s life. The suffering comes because we run, avoid, repress, and deny our pain. If we don’t acknowledge and take responsibility for our wounds, but instead we deny and repress them, the wounds inflicted on us, we will inflict those same wounds on others and the next generation. I wonder if the author was extremely sexually abused as a child and now wants to repress his sexuality and of his readers – what we repress will find expression in a very dysfunctional way and will harm us and others even more. All religions have been trying to repress people’s sexuality and the author sounds preach like the very extreme religious people that use strong, harsh language that is guilt-inducing and we have seen religion’s guilt-inducing where gotten us. I wonder if one of his parents was a preacher -- Children that are preached to, learn to preach -- Maybe his parents were extremely critical of him and used strong, harsh language and made him feel guilty and now unconsciously he is extremely critical and passing this guilt to his readers.

Sylvie Imelda Shene: I also stand by my words that this book is confusing and if something is confusing is also abusive to me. Saying that this book is the continuation of Alice Miller’s work is a big lie even if people are not aware and can’t see the hidden lie. Alice Miller’s work is so much ahead of this book. DM’s book is so tinted with morality and so manipulative that brings back old memories in my mind when I was living with my religious fanatic and manipulative older sisters, that tried so hard to push down my throat their beliefs and morality. The letter written to Alice Miller in the link below articulates what I feel DM’s book is trying to do to his readers.

http://www.alice-miller.com/readersmail_en.php?lang=en&nid=2371&grp=1108

Sylvie Imelda Shene: I am very aware that I cannot open the eyes of people that don’t want to see and feel and if people choose to believe in lies is their problem. Just like Alice Miller confirmed in her answer to my letter in the link below: From Alice Miller am@.com> Subject: Re: Saying the truth or being loyal To: s@.com Date: Sunday, November 9, 2008, 1:21 AM AM: Thank you for your letter. I am sorry that my answer to your previous letter didn't appear on the website under your text. I wrote: "Congratulations on your understanding. You are right, you can't make someone see who DOESN'T WANT to see." Alice Miller wrote this message

http://www.alice-miller.com/readersmail_en.php?lang=en&nid=2337&grp=1108

Sylvie Imelda Shene: I am not going to comment here anymore, because I am very aware I cannot make people see and feel what they are not ready to see and feel and if they rather believe in lies is nothing I can do, but to walk away. When someone is trying to confuse you consciously or unconsciously is abuse even if people can’t see it as such. Sylvie Imelda Shene: I have to clarify the phrase that seems to have created confusion “'If something is confusing to me it is abusive to me' I should have said if someone is telling me a lie consciously or unconsciously it’s abusive to me, because lies are always confusing and abusive, of course, there are a lot of things in this world that I don’t understand and are not abusive, but lies are always abusive no matter who says them and how nice they sound.

S’s Letter

S, I think it's important that I mention what I witnessed happening at the DM's book discussion http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/note.php?note_id=471710483293 you were I agree with me, but the moment DM showed up and share his opinion, which of course has the right to do so, you moved right to his side and apologized to him for disagreeing with him and your misunderstanding and my question was -- why does she have the need to do that? Maybe she still carries the fear of her parents and now someone symbolizing her parents, in this case, DM, and like when she was a very little girl would not dare to rebel against her parents for fear of punishment and repressed her true feelings in order to please her parents and be the "good girl" her parents desired, now, in her adult life this internalized fear of her parents is still keeping her from staying true to herself. You know this happened to me also on a discussion board a year or so ago at amazon.com on the topic, of spanking was harmful to children, and most people there were pro-spanking and I felt the need to comment and expose their ignorance and of course, these very unconscious people, started to personally attack me right away, they called me the B word, radical, and all kind of things, you name it! One poster that identified himself as being a Psychiatric doctor took my side at first, and of course temporally I felt better that I was not alone anymore against those very mean unconscious people, but the moment the pro-spanking people started to direct their anger at him accusing him of being radical and lunatic because only a lunatic would be at Sylvie's side! the next day he took the pro-spanking side agreeing with them that my comment was too radical – below is the comment I used to re-post over and over again and they thought was too radical and they could not stand and triggered them the most. I now, understand and see very well these psychological mechanisms, and did not affect me much that this doctor one day was on my side and the next day like a scared little boy took the abuser's side. A professional doctor should have dealt with his own fear and learned how to handle transference. I thought of the little child going to his office with his parents and one day he takes the child's side, but in the moment the parent starts transferring their anger into him he leaves the child alone and takes the parents' side, how the damage that is to a child to one day feel like somebody is on his side, but a day later to find himself again abandoned in an emotional desert island. Children have no way of understanding that the reason this person abandoned him also was because of his internalized fears of his own parents. This is why people that go out offering help to others without experiencing, understand and walk through their own fears first, they will unconsciously and compulsively pass their psychological virus into others under the disguise of help and this is very damaging to people that are still wounded, especially to children.

Amazon.com post: These people are so "SMART" that they don't see the more they mention my name and project themselves into me the more they make themselves look bad. Keep making yourselves look bad, ignorant, and very dark people.

People that idealize their childhood and parents will keep having limitless cravings for scapegoats on whom they can avenge themselves for the fears and anxieties of childhood without having to re-experience those fears. DEFENSELESS LITTLE CHILDREN MAKE PERFECT SCAPEGOATS FOR THEM, COWARDS. Pro-spanking people suffer and secretly enjoy seeing others suffer too, otherwise, why would they fight so hard for the parents' right to spank their innocent children, when children misbehave is never the child's fault, but the parents' fault, and if someone needs a spanking would be the parents. Children are like sponges or antennas that absorb all of what their parents repressed. What parents repress, children express, so if you don't like what you see in your children go inside of yourself and take responsibility for all that is repressed in yourself and your children will change without you having to do much. And what is so sad for me it's that most of these pro-spanking, hypocrites, cowards hide behind "God" to do their evil work. Read the article "How Evil is Born anew with every new generation" in the link below:

http://www.alice-miller.com/articles_en.php?lang=en&nid=47&grp=11

It's so sad that in the 21 century, people still are debating if it's ok to spank a child. In the 21 century, everyone should know the dangers of spanking children and every person in power should be doing everything to make sure every child is protected from harm. Would we be debating today if slavery of black people or any other race is ok, fortunately, is common knowledge that slavery of another race is cruel and ignorant. Why can human beings see that doing it to children is even more cruel, ignorant, and very dangerous? Most people's objective is not freedom for themselves and others. Most people's objective is to one day have their own slaves. The easiest way to have your own slaves is to give birth to them because our society does nothing to protect children in the first years of life, the most important years of a person's life." Poisonous Pedagogy The pedagogical conviction that one must bring a child into line from the outset has its origin in the need to split off the disquieting parts of the inner self and project them onto an available object. The child's great plasticity flexibility, defenselessness, and availability made it the ideal object for this projection. The enemy within can, at last, be hunted down on the outside. Peace advocates are becoming increasingly aware of the role played by these mechanisms, but until it is clearly recognized that they can be traced back to methods of child raising, little can be done to oppose them. For children who have grown up being assailed for qualities the parents hate in themselves can hardly wait to assign these qualities to someone else so they can once again regard themselves as good, "moral," noble, and altruistic. Such projections can easily become part of any Weltanschauung." Alice Miller "THE CHILD AS POISON CONTAINER The main psychological mechanism that operates in all child abuse involves using children as what I have termed poison containers--receptacles into which adults project disowned parts of their psyches, so they can control these feelings in another body without danger to themselves. In good parenting, the child uses the caretaker as a poison container, much as it earlier used the mother's placenta as a poison container for cleansing its polluted blood. A good mother reacts with calming actions to the cries of a baby and helps it "detoxify² its dangerous emotions. But when an immature mother's baby cries, she cannot stand the screaming and strikes out at the child. As one battering mother put it, "I have never felt loved all my life. When the baby was born, I thought he would love me. When he cried, it meant he didn't love me. So I hit him.² Rather than the child being able to use the parent to detoxify its fears and anger, the parent instead injects his or her bad feelings into the child and uses it to cleanse his or herself of depression and anger."

http://www.psychohistory.com/htm/05_history.html  

---Then they accused me of violating Alice Miller's copyright and I assure them that she did not mind me distributing her literature freely. One morning I woke up thinking I bet they wrote to Alice Miller to complain about me violating her copyright and I went to her website to readers' mail page and sure enough, I found the following letter, when I saw the letter with the tile "Respecting the copyright" and I knew right away it was about me and I clicked on it with excitement to read Alice Miller's answer.

"Respecting the copyright Saturday, October 31, 2009

Dear Ms. Miller,

On a "no-spank" thread on Amazon, one of your readers has copied and pasted pages upon pages of your work. One of the copies was of a webpage you allow people to copy and re-post in its entirety, but most of the content seems to end with an "all rights reserved" copyright. In some cases, the person is even copy/pasting the works of your fellow authors and attributing your website, which might not exactly rub them the right way.

http://www.amazon.com/tag/health/forum/ref=cm_cd_et_md_pl?_encoding=UTF8&cdForum=Fx1EO24KZG65FCB&cdMsgNo=6427&cdPage=258&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx2RVZKR3QEDU6P&cdMsgID=Mx28QB17UEUHKGE#Mx28QB17UEUHKGE

We've been concerned about her zeal for copy/paste of copyrighted works for some time, but responsibility dictates that since the poster has failed to see the legal and moral issues, we should at the very least alert you of this.

AM: Thank you for your letter and the link. I opened it and found a discussion led very respectfully by Sylvie Shene who seems to understand much about the dangers of spanking that produce beside other things ignorant parents in future. Of course, the Internet allows everybody to show themselves, their emotional insights as well as their emotional blindness (like "I was very much beaten but I turned out very well"). But I didn't find an example of anybody using my name for a text that I have NOT written. Did I miss anything? If you did find this kind of abuse, of disrespecting my copyright, please let me know."

This letter is no longer available on Alice Miller's website, I believe the coward that wrote it asked her to remove it because I had copied and pasted it into the amazon.com thread with the following comment and a link to it: To the person that wrote to Dr. Alice Miller, did her answer put your concerns to rest? It's so funny to witness to the extent the pro-spanking people go to, to stop me from sharing the enlightened information here, they tried to break me, but that did not work, because you can not break what's not breakable anymore! Would not it be easier to put me in your ignore list? What are you afraid of? Afraid your children might come here? Become enlightened and be able to see through your lies and illusions. This just shows how conniving some pro-spanking people are. The next morning I clicked on the link from the amazon.com thread to see if it was working and the letter was no longer available at her website. This person did not like Alice Miller's response and he/she asked her to remove it because when people clicked on the link could see for themselves their desperation. Later they accused me of fabricating this letter myself! All my life I have stood alone against the liars and cowards in this world and it felt so good to have Alice Miller stand on my side, I never had anyone before stand on my side like that, I have no words to express how happy I felt to know I was not alone anymore.

Alice Miller has been the only person that truly has been on my side.

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=458883030451